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I am pessimistic
They are playing
with world economy
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Kazem Vaziri
Hamaneh |
O il
prices are soaring high and new records are set every day. How do you see
long-term prospects of international oil prices?
We better first
have a look at energy consumption model and factors behind the changes. Global
oil demand stood at 85.7 million barrels per day in 2007 and is expected to
hit 87 million barrels per day by 2008. In 2007, non-OPEC oil producing
countries supplied about 53.8 million barrels per day oil to the market while
the figure has reached 55.3 million barrels per day in 2008. OPEC’s share of
the market stood at 31.9 million barrels per day in 2007 and has reached 31.8
million barrels per day in 2008. That is, production share of the Organization
of Petroleum Exporting Countries has remained almost unchanged. Another
important development was increased energy storage by the Organization for
Economic Cooperation and Development OECD) countries, which reached its peak
at 53 million barrels.
You mean oil reserves of OECD members states have increased
despite high prices?
It has greatly
increased. The world economic growth rate stood at 4.9 percent in 2007 and is
predicted to hit 3.9 percent in 2008. Another point is that the number of
contracts signed by oil market speculators in March 2008 has been estimated at
88,300 contracts. The figure showed an increase of about 33,300 contracts
compared to February. The number of contracts in March 2007 stood at 48,800;
that is, contracts signed in March 2008 were double those signed in March
2007.
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We do not use dollar in our transactions anymore. We
sell our oil in return for various currencies. |
You mean high oil prices have made previously uneconomical
investments, economical?
I mean, the
money has moved toward the oil market. Although oil prices in international
markets have increased, its real value according to base price of 2001 is
lower than the nominal price. The parity of the dollar against euro, yen,
pound, and franc respectively fell by 5.3 percent, 6 percent, 2 percent, and
7.31 percent in March.
You mean this year’s March compared to last year’s?
No. The fall
occurred in a single month. OPEC oil was sold for 90.64 dollars per barrel in
February, but it was sold for 99.3 dollars per barrel in March. When
calculated on the basis of fixed dollar parity in 2001, those figures would be
translated into 57.42 dollars per barrel and 60.43 dollars per barrel.
We are not selling oil in dollars.
We do not use
dollar in our transactions anymore. We sell our oil in return for various
currencies. The main factors which have caused oil prices to rise are not high
demand, shortage of oil in the market, or inadequate supply by OPEC and
non-OPEC producers. The supply is even higher than last year while economic
growth in the world has lowered. Normally, the world should demand less oil,
but the supply is still increasing. Both supply and demand are rising. This is
not a phenomenon which could be justified in accordance to economic rules.
Other factors are also influential. Therefore, providing a serious future
forecast is well-nigh impossible.
You noted that despite rising prices, oil reserves have
increased. What does this mean?
It means that
since European countries know that prices may rise tomorrow, therefore, they
are increasing their reserve today. Their economic situation is stable and
their economic growth rate has not been downward. Economic situation of
countries and the balance between supply and demand was another factor based
on which situation of oil markets could have been predicted in the past. If a
country ceased production, since demand was fixed or growing, the price would
have increased. On the other hand, if supply increased, prices would have
fallen. However, at present, both demand and supply are high. Economic growth
rate has fallen, and prices are rising. Perhaps increased reserves and
speculation have affected price growth. Also, based on the existing studies,
the economic situation in the United States and devaluation of the dollar has
inflicted as much as 77 billion dollars in losses to European countries and
the United States, along, has suffered about 1,000 billion dollars in losses.
This shows that increased oil prices cannot be simply attributed to
speculation, increased reserves, or devaluation of the dollar. Other factors
are in work to keep prices rising. It should be noted that increased oil
prices are not totally in favor of oil producing countries. Producing
countries are apparently selling oil at 30 percent higher than previous
prices, but the value of Iranian oil installations which are imported; have in
some cases increased 2.5 times.
That is 250 percent?
Yes.
Analyses which have been presented by American analysts
indicate that the United States has helped Saudi Arabia, by increasing oil
price and reducing parity of the dollar, to use part of their oil facilities,
which were not economical before, and pay part of the foreign debts. At the
same time, the United States is seriously confronting countries like China. Do
you accept this analysis?
Apparently, all
these facts are true. There is another point that you have not referred to.
When oil prices are high, production of non-hydrocarbon fuel or new energies
increase and countries try to replace them for hydrocarbon fuels. On the other
hand, energy storage has become common. These two factors in addition to their
impact on demand had reduced prices. However, during the past two years, both
prices and reserves have increased. This shows that insecurity is on the
horizon. Perhaps I am pessimistic, but I think that the situation is
worrisome. I think they are causing problems to meet their own economic
interests. I think that they are playing with world economy and part of market
developments are due to speculations. They have a lot of money and use it for
speculation at international oil markets.
Are you agreed to gasoline rationing in its current form?
I don’t think
that rationing is a good solution in the 21st century. When they
introduced smart cards, I told them that this was not a basic solution, which
can be implemented at all times. I don’t know. This has not been done in any
part of the world. But we were ordered by the parliament to do so. I abide by
the law. We did our best and implemented the plan after a delay of one month.
Rationing led to no major problem, unless in the first night. Rationing is one
issue, but reducing consumption is another. From the viewpoint of consumption
decrease, the plan was successful. Last year, rationing reduced consumption by
20 percent and this was a great achievement.
Did it reduce consumption or consumption figure has become
more transparent?
It has reduced
consumption. We have a mechanized system after 1960s which shows annual
consumption figures for every province and for every city. Even consumption of
every gas station is clear. Part of the consumption reduction is due to
reduced smuggling. Part of it pertains to phasing out dilapidated cars and
another part can be attributed to increased number of public transportation
vehicles. Consumption reduction has been very good, but I do not agree with
the method through which it has been established.
What method you are agreed to?
What they do in
other parts of the world?
Correcting prices?
Bolstering
public transportation, improving consumption, and correcting prices are good
options. If all cars in our country consume four liters of gasoline per 100
kilometers, people would not consume more than 100 liters per month even in
the absence of rationing. The problem is that domestically produced cars use
17-18 liters gasoline per 100 km. On the other hand, we try to solve problems
by giving subsidies. According to the latest estimate that has been announced
by Mr. (Akbar) Torkan (deputy oil minister) in an interview with a newspaper,
was the figure on hydrocarbon fuels subsidy, which amounts to 88 billion
dollars a year. We can do many things with that money. At the same time,
payment of that subsidy has caused many problems including air pollution and
various diseases.
You said in your farewell session that you had not resigned
your post. You also noted that during your two-year tenure, performance of the
Ministry of Petroleum had outdone your expectations. Please explain about that
performance.
I cannot give
you accurate figures right now, but all indexes which were mentioned by the
first vice president, Dr. (Parviz) Davoudi, after my speech, were quite
telltale. All indexes had improved compared to the past. In a farewell
ceremony, they usually do not appreciate the performance of a deposed
minister, but the realities could not be denied. I had already released a
report on those achievements and the performance of Ministry of Petroleum was
much better than I expected.
What about attraction of foreign investments to oil and gas
sectors?
The figures were
positive when I left the ministry.
Attraction of investment or investment agreements?
I talked about
agreements and the capital which had been imported into the country.
Why, despite all the figures which showed your successful
performance, they deposed you? Minister of petroleum is among important
ministers in Iran. So, why you were dismissed in spite of your performance?
The best reason
was “difference in tastes”. The president used that phrase too.
What kind of difference?
Let’s stay away
from details.
Did those differences pertain to price adjustment methods?
Such trivial
matters do not lead to such serious differences between president and a
minister as to lead to deposition. We had differences on how to manage the oil
industry. When he told me that he wanted to change me, I told him he could do
as he wished. When they told me, I expressed hope that this would be in the
benefit of the Islamic Republic of Iran.
But you insisted on your viewpoints?
Yes. One hundred
percent!
Do you believe in oil mafia?
Not in the sense
that is now discussed in the society. During two years in office, I said on
many occasions that it was possible for a few people to join hands in any
organization to meet their interests. For example, they may decide to give a
project to a certain company and be paid in return. But this cannot be called
mafia. This is corruption. It may be found at all state-run organizations. If
somebody claimed that it does not exist, I’d prove that it does. Corruption
may be everywhere from the presidential office to any ministry. Anywhere money
abounds, possibility for corruption is higher. But I don’t accept that there
is an organized current which is guided by one or few people. After the
Islamic Revolution, all pre-revolution managers were removed from their posts
and only 3-4 percent of them have remained. Most of them are now retired. Once
I jokingly said, “Perhaps I am the last of my kind and when I go, mafia will
leave the oil industry.”
So, mafia is projection and they aim to blame a
hypothetical enemy for shortcomings in the oil sector?
There is
corruption. We filed some corruption cases with judicial authorities. We also
reinstituted internal mechanism of the Ministry of Petroleum to fight
corruption. However, there is much difference between a single case of
corruption with one or few persons as beneficiary, and the whole structure of
a state-run body. I don’t think that there is a structural mafia in the
Ministry of Petroleum.
Let’s talk about statute of the Ministry of Petroleum as
well as the National Iranian Oil Company, the National Iranian Gas Company,
and the National Petrochemical Company. Mr. Nozari is planning to take back
the statute which was drawn up in your time because you have highlighted the
role of the National Iranian Oil Company and have made the National Iranian
Gas Company and the National Petrochemical Company its subsidiaries.
The companies
which have been established by the statute are four executive companies and
one holding company. The National Iranian Oil Company is an international
company and the third international company in the world. If capitals of other
companies are taken out of the National Iranian Oil Company, its ranking would
have fallen. To prevent this, we reached the conclusion that operations should
be separated from decision-making company. Therefore, we decided to have a new
company for exploration and production of oil and gas to take over oil
exploration and other upstream operations from the National Iranian Oil
Company. The National Iranian Oil Company was set to be a holding company with
four subsidiary companies which would be active in the field of gas,
petrochemicals, refining and distribution, as well as exploration and
production of oil and gas. Those companies have been mentioned in the statute
in order to keep their assets inside the National Iranian Oil Company.
What factors are taken into account when rating companies?
Various factors
are taken into consideration including financial turnover, assets,
installations, reserves, investment and similar issues.
What would happen if the statute that your team compiled
were changed the way you wanted?
International
standing of the National Iranian Oil Company will be promoted. It will become
a specialized company and a new oil and gas exploration and production company
will be established to take charge of upstream operations.
Let’s talk about gas. Gas has become a complex issue. Are
you optimistic about signing a new contract for gas exports to Europe?
Yes. We must
start gas exports. We have the world’s second largest gas reserves.
We “must” means that we want to or that it is possible?
Both. We want to
and we must do it. Europe needs gas and its gas market is monopolized by
Russia. They like to end that monopoly. We must claim our share of that
market. Both sides of the equation should progress hand in hand. Apart from
signing contracts, saving on gas consumption should be practiced. If the
current consumption trend continued, there would be no more gas for exports
within the next 10 years. Consumption is high in all economic sectors while
output is illogical. Compared to any country, gas consumption in Iran is both
excessive and uneconomical. If consumption is improved, 50 percent of the gas
which is consumed now will be stored to be exported. We have needed
potentials. From the time of (Reza) Aqazadeh (former minister of petroleum), I
had discussed this. My master’s degree thesis was about role of subsidies in
energy consumption which I forwarded to the then officials of the ministry.
Since that time, everybody knows that this form of energy consumption will
lead the country to its doom.
Are we moving toward the goals of the 20-Year Perspective
Plan in energy sector?
Yes. We are
lagging behind, but we are moving ahead. There have been plans for the oil
sector before the revolution; both five-year plans and long-term plans. Oil
has never been without a plan, even for a single year.
Recently, a contract was signed with a Swiss energy group;
just at the time that Switzerland has frozen the assets of 23 Iranian
companies.
The contract was
signed before the freeze.
Do you think that such contracts will be fulfilled despite
these measures?
At present, Iran is facing political problems due to
pressures from the United States. All countries are under pressure. Mr. Putin
signed sanctions order against Iran during his last day as the Russian
president. However, Switzerland needs gas. We are bound to sell it. The path
crosses through Turkey. An agreement has been already signed with Turkey. All
legal conditions have been met, but you cannot predict whether another state
institution will intervene and end the agreement or not. However, you cannot
stop the work due to such vague factors. |